My car oversteers and is tail happy after installing coilovers... Help!

[rayDC2R]

So I've noticed that ever since I installed coilovers in my DC2R, it now has the tendency to oversteer. Now I know that could be a good thing for a FWD in some aspects, but when it does it on the street, it is no good.
e.g. I go straight through a roundabout at a faster speed than recommended, maybe 60 km/h and the back suddenly loses traction when I turn back in... So coming into the roundabout, you would turn a bit left due the roundabout being round, then turn back in (right) and this is the point where my car would lose traction at the rear. It also happens when I take a small roundabout at speed, like a 90 degree turn. I'm not talking 100 km/h but maybe 50-60 km/h. When I do the turns, the rear slides like a mofo and I have to countersteer to fix it up. Its as if I'm drifting. It is that bad! And this is on dry roads... even worse when wet!

Before I installed coilovers, I could take the same roundabouts at the same speed with ease, or with slight understeer, but now it loses traction at the rear and fishtails.

Some factors to note:

-Tyres possibly suck... pair of cheap but brand new Nitto Neogens, and a pair used Dunlop Direzza Sport Z1 Star Spec which came with the wheels I got (looks like at least 50% tread left but I'm not sure because I've never owned them brand new, but indicators show still has lots of tread). It doesn't matter which tyres are at the rear, both will still lose traction.
-Zeal Function X coilovers, settings are: front at 20 (stiffest 30), rear at 10.
Spring rates unknown, but previous owner thinks maybe 12/8??
-I have an OEM rear strut bar

So what could possibly be causing me to lose traction in the rear? And what can I try to do to fix it?

[sleepingperformance]

Re: My car oversteers and is tail happy after installing coilovers... Help!

What are your rear dampers set at? They may be a bit stiff...

[Karl]

Since you installed the coil overs, was a wheel alignment done. As im sure your not running the same height.

Has the rear been stripped. As no rear weight and stiffer springs will cause this.

Id try dropping the softness down all the way"at the rear". If that fixes the problem slowly put it back up untill the sweet spots found!

You may find it acts differently to a full or empty tank or petrol!

[rhys.l]

Sounds like the rear is too stiff.

I've always thought the stock suspension is best in the dc2r. Maybe slightly lower and stiffer. A lot of people think coil overs are the be all and end all, but given the spring rates most of them run, you are going to be losing grip in most street situations compared to the stock suspension.

[rayDC2R]

As in the original post, I am running 10 clicks from the softest setting in the rear.
My car is not stripped and is pretty much stock...
I got a 4 wheel alignment done after install.
I figured the rear is too stiff, but I didn't really want to remove the OEM strut bar.
I will try to put it to the softest setting in the rear... If that fails, I dunno what else to do...

[felixR]

My car oversteers and is tail happy after installing coilovers... Help!

You can try making the front dampers stiffer as well.

[Karl]

As in the original post, I am running 10 clicks from the softest setting in the rear.
My car is not stripped and is pretty much stock...
I got a 4 wheel alignment done after install.
I figured the rear is too stiff, but I didn't really want to remove the OEM strut bar.
I will try to put it to the softest setting in the rear... If that fails, I dunno what else to do...

Stock sway bar?

Yes put on minumal and go from there! Id also recommend checkin the rear trailing arm bushes. When they go the car can step out randomly!

[tinkerbell]

um, maybe you don't need to adjust your settings, you need to adjust your driving? (you know i mean no offense right mate!)

that would be one explorable solution

but it it IS indeed actual 'snap' over steer, rather than driver induced (too aggressive inputs) oversteer - you have a more fundamental problem.

but finding out the spring rates will help too - especially if the front springs have been installed accidentally in the rear!

[tinkerbell]

I've always thought the stock suspension is best in the dc2r. Maybe slightly lower and stiffer. A lot of people think coil overs are the be all and end all, but given the spring rates most of them run, you are going to be losing grip in most street situations compared to the stock suspension.

which is why the driver needs to adjust a bit too

[rayDC2R]

No offence taken dave... But like I said... I've taken the exact same roundabouts at the same speeds (sometimes quicker) before coilovers, and no such problems with rear losing traction like this...
I'm pretty sure previous owner said 12/8 for spring rates... How can I personally find out? Are there markings on the spring?

And stock STRUT bar, not sway bar... The optional OEM DC2R strut bar in the boot/hatch of the car...

It actually scares me to take corners fast now in fear of losing control and hitting the gutter or another vehicle... And ITR's are meant to take corners!

[tinkerbell]

No offence taken dave... But like I said... I've taken the exact same roundabouts at the same speeds (sometimes quicker) before coilovers, and no such problems with rear losing traction like this...
I'm pretty sure previous owner said 12/8 for spring rates... How can I personally find out? Are there markings on the spring?

And stock STRUT bar, not sway bar... The optional OEM DC2R strut bar in the boot/hatch of the car...

It actually scares me to take corners fast now in fear of losing control and hitting the gutter or another vehicle... And ITR's are meant to take corners!

you need to let someone who knows drive it... to know if the springs are on backwards - but that is an UNUSUAL possibility and highly unlikely...

but basically you need to know that you have made a SIGNIFICANT modification to your car that means: you CANT go as fast as you used to (with standard normal suspension - like ryhs said) through roundabouts!

OK?

roundabouts are not a very good determinant of handling, it is too fast a switchback/weight transfer scenario...

the race track is where you can test handling modifications...

for example, in the first few rounds of the hillclimbs (which are not race tracks, but abandoned old roads up hills), i was running hardcore 'track spec' 14/10 springs, and was losing control and had to go slower to not crash, but i still broke all the Road Registered class records for my capacity.

and it was only after watching the Lancer GSR and VT Commodore, with stock springs rolling and pitching up the hills that i realised i HAD to go to softer springs to make my car faster on the hillclimb circuits...

and it paid off big time when i went back to the 10/6 setup that was standard with Tein Monoflex...

part of the reason why - was that my R-compound tyres could not get to the same HOT track temps in the 30 seconds i had to get up the hill as they would after a 90 seconds warm up lap at the race circuit... i had to start my tyre pressures at 26/25 psi cold to not lose control...

but on a TRACK, after warming up and increasing the friction coefficient of the tyres by getting them hot and sticky (i.e. the job of R-comp semi-slicks) then i COULD go really fast and expect my 14/10 setup to make me faster...

so the story is that harder and stiffer suspension ONLY works when you have tyres that are STICKIER and have higher grip levels...

are you following?

so trying to go 60kmh through a roundabout with cold tyres and STIFF suspension means you are going to LOSE CONTROL, much much before you used to with soft and compliant standard suspension...

yeah?

so you need to slow down your entry to corners (on the roads) and adjust your driving style to account for the stiffer suspension and cold tyres (your road tyres will never get warm enough on a daily drive to give you enough traction to be able to dive at the capability of the suspension...)

i hope this makes sense,

and doesnt make you sad that you did a modification that you might not really like, unless you are on the race track...

like the stupid saying goes: "because race car"

[rayDC2R]

That is actually awesome advice! Yes I followed and understand it all... Thanks Dave.
When you put it that way, I guess it just comes down to getting used to it and adjusting my driving style... And in the future, getting better tyres...
I guess I was expecting an improvement in handling in all aspects of every day driving on the street, which wasn't the right thing to do.
Physics... You gotta love it eh?

[rhys.l]

I reckon it should make you sad :P Do you even take your car on the track man?

I'm running Spoon Progressive springs on the stock dc2r shocks and I think that's a great combination for sporty street driving. They are only slightly stiffer than stock, and drop the car to a nice height. In the future, will probably go some Koni yellows with ground control springs, of a rate of my choice.

People can go 'because race car' all they like, but why would you spend money to make your street car slower and more uncomfortable?

[tinkerbell]

That is actually awesome advice! Yes I followed and understand it all... Thanks Dave.

you only got it as you are a long standing member who knows how to take my style of advice, imagine if i told a new guy all that??!! could have gotten ugly eh!?

but

now that we have got past the 'why', now we can focus on the 'what' to do bit...

like everyone has already said (good advice from everyone )

hopefully by tightening up the front (to increase understeer tendency) and softening up the back ( to to reduce oversteer tendency) you probably will make it more safe and enjoyable to drive.

and further, by analysing the wheel alignment settings we could check there is no problem there... (maybe the tyre guy dialed in heaps of toe??)

so did you get a print out of the settings?

or is it a guy you know?

or you could take it back and say that it is too aggressive, "could you please dial out the oversteer?"

and lastly - because they are not brand new - you need to rule out that they are actually OK...

oh and finally - TYRES TYRES TYRES

you cant expect a car to be safe or enjoyable if the tyres are not appropriate, either by grip level, tyre pressure or worn out... so check you pressures and make sure they are all the same, and consider replacing them as a set... (but the fact you say the 'roundabout test' was passed with the old tyres indicates they are not the biggest issue here)

[Teneo]

God advice there Tinkerbell!