Track Tyres Thread - experiences only...

[tinkerbell]

this thread is for discussing tyres for tracking...

be they *real* racing rubber or *street* rubber...

e.g.

i recently did the 2012 NSW Hillclimb Championship which is basically going as fast as you can up a hill without a warm up or anything... runs were around 30 - 40 seconds depending on the track...

my tyres were Kumho V70A in 205/50R15 which were 'heat treated' by Vsport.

i ran staring pressures of 32psi, but after a few rounds realised that these were way too high, so ended up aiming for 28psi starting pressure to ensure that the tyres gripped (because they didn't have time to heat up).

in the 2007 NSW Supersprint Championship which is basically a 4 lap session and the FTD wins...

i ran Toyo R888's in 205/50R15 straight out of the box in GG compound.

i ran starting pressures of 29 front and 31 rear to ensure that my HOT pressures were around 34psi after a cool down lap and a few laps of the pits (extra cool down).

these were both with aggressive camber and toe settings, like 3+ degrees camber F&R and +2mm toe out...

i have also run Dunlop DJ01's, Bridgestone RE55s and Toyo RA1 tyres, all of which wre excellent and had similar pressure requirements to the R888s... (the RE55s were most forgiving when outside their ideal range)

the MOST important way to tune tyres is the air pressure gauge - get GOOD one, and use it all the time.

(if you borrow one - it might not be the same as your usual one)

for street - i have run two sets of Dunlop Z1 star spec tyres in 205/50R16 - these are AWESOME on the road and i run these at around 38psi

[Symphorced]

Re: track tyres thread - experiences only...

Any recommendations on an tyre air pressure gauge? Looking to buy one for track days but no idea what to look for in one.

[tinkerbell]

this is the one i use:

http://cgi.ebay.com.au/ws/eBayISAPI....:X:RTQ:AU:1123

doing OK after 4 years,

going to get a group buy going for JSCC for the 2013 seasons (and i guess CITR) so should be fairly cheap... if you want one...

[pbk1776]

Achilles 123/S
Bang for the buck - this when they haven't jacked up the price
before you can pick them up for $500 for 4

Great tyres a lot of AU clubs use them as well.

Now a days you get them for $195 for 235/45/17 per tyre

[felixR]

^ How were they on the track Raf?

[lukits01]

my quick impressions from what I've tested on my FN2, mostly for sprints or auto-test type events

Toyo R888: not the fastest semi slicks by far, but the easiest to use, No need to worry too much about pressures or temperature, just go out and drive them. Compound lasts quite awhile but will overheat given constant laps. Good as a starting tire for sprints, auto-x, hill climb, decent enough for trackday, cheap, can be easily had from taleb tyre or elsewhere.

Bridgestone RE55S: fast circuit tire, but they are HORRIBLE when cold. Can handle continuous abuse at the circuit, give it a few warm up laps and strap yourselves on and feel the Gs! These tires will carry amazing cornering speed and give consistent times on track. Compound will last awhile, and the decline in performance with heat cycle is not too bad. Sidewalls are very stiff, probably the most solid compared to the others I've tried.

Dunlop D03G: The dunlops are a lot more tricky, they have a very narrow operating window, if you stay in it they deliver grip like no other. They are a very soft compound tire, I would not recommend them for circuit work, when you overheat them they leave chunks of rubber on the tarmac. Not very good when cold, but quite easy to warm up, grip gets worst pretty quickly the more heat cycles you put on them. When on low tread depth, the compound can literally disintegrate underneath you as they come off the tire carcass. Time wise, these were very fast, but the compound is not very stable.

Kumho V70A: Best all-round tire for me, especially good on wet or damp condition. Ultimate peak grip probably not the same level as A050 or D03G but the V70A has a very stable compound. Never found any overheating issue. The wear rate is very good, haven't finished my set yet but so far the grip seems pretty consistent with heat cycles. They behaved alright when cold, I didn't have a problem using them as a sprint or autotest tire, the rear gets a bit loose from standing start, but after the first few corners they already feel planted. Seemed alright as a trackday tire as well, didn't complain with constant lapping, provided you get the pressures right.

Yokohama A050: The first time I used these tires in anger I was just absolutely blown away by the times they produce, they are by some margin the fastest tire I've tried so far. BUT, that was on a cold-ish day (I.E. Ideal conditions). Cold grip is very good, perfect tire for sprint or autotest. For a semi slick, the sidewalls are pretty soft, for some cars you might have to take that into account when setting up the suspension. I wouldn't say they overheat, but they don't seem to handle heat that well, they produce their peak grip on the first lap or two and consistently gets slower and slower afterwards. The same with the heat cycling, when new, they are absolutely gobsmackingly quick, but soon afterwards, they are still a fast tire just not as stunningly fast as the first few heat cycles. I've seen a few of the more well off cars compete with these then sell them off after a few events because they werent 'as fast' (Fine by me as it was a damn sight better than buying them new, these things are expensive!!) Wear rate is reasonable, the compound is pretty soft but they didn't wear down as quickly as the D03G but not as long lasting as RE55S or V70A.

[pbk1776]

^ How were they on the track Raf?

Hi MR FA

They're pretty good - like I said its bang for the buck $195 per tyre against other brands which are double the price.

Wears evenly - grip is excellent however it is a bit slower than R888 and other expensive brands - what I meant slow
is that you will notice it. Also second time in wakefield with the R - first time with road tyres manage 1.20 then with this tyres manage 1.17 no practices in between just thought about of changing tyres when I took the car out for the second time.

HOWEVER, I highly recommend they brand for novices like me - coming off a street tyre then semi's - recommendable for
beginners, seasonal track people and with tight pockets.

Source? ebay or tyre shops at Illawara or st george

[ChargeR]

Any recommendations on an tyre air pressure gauge? Looking to buy one for track days but no idea what to look for in one.

I have a Longacre one like this: LINK and it has worked well for 4-5 years or so up until recently when after returning from being slutted around the pits at Winton it now reads 7.5 psi high. I don't think it's an inherent fault in the gauge more likely mistreatment by borrowers...

I bought an Intercomp for my brother like this one: LINK I liked it better than the Longacre one I have, it sat more nicely in the hand, bled pressure more quickly and has a swivel on the hose.

[cordz]

my quick impressions from what I've tested on my FN2, mostly for sprints or auto-test type events

Toyo R888: not the fastest semi slicks by far, but the easiest to use, No need to worry too much about pressures or temperature, just go out and drive them. Compound lasts quite awhile but will overheat given constant laps. Good as a starting tire for sprints, auto-x, hill climb, decent enough for trackday, cheap, can be easily had from taleb tyre or elsewhere.

Bridgestone RE55S: fast circuit tire, but they are HORRIBLE when cold. Can handle continuous abuse at the circuit, give it a few warm up laps and strap yourselves on and feel the Gs! These tires will carry amazing cornering speed and give consistent times on track. Compound will last awhile, and the decline in performance with heat cycle is not too bad. Sidewalls are very stiff, probably the most solid compared to the others I've tried.

Dunlop D03G: The dunlops are a lot more tricky, they have a very narrow operating window, if you stay in it they deliver grip like no other. They are a very soft compound tire, I would not recommend them for circuit work, when you overheat them they leave chunks of rubber on the tarmac. Not very good when cold, but quite easy to warm up, grip gets worst pretty quickly the more heat cycles you put on them. When on low tread depth, the compound can literally disintegrate underneath you as they come off the tire carcass. Time wise, these were very fast, but the compound is not very stable.

Kumho V70A: Best all-round tire for me, especially good on wet or damp condition. Ultimate peak grip probably not the same level as A050 or D03G but the V70A has a very stable compound. Never found any overheating issue. The wear rate is very good, haven't finished my set yet but so far the grip seems pretty consistent with heat cycles. They behaved alright when cold, I didn't have a problem using them as a sprint or autotest tire, the rear gets a bit loose from standing start, but after the first few corners they already feel planted. Seemed alright as a trackday tire as well, didn't complain with constant lapping, provided you get the pressures right.

Yokohama A050: The first time I used these tires in anger I was just absolutely blown away by the times they produce, they are by some margin the fastest tire I've tried so far. BUT, that was on a cold-ish day (I.E. Ideal conditions). Cold grip is very good, perfect tire for sprint or autotest. For a semi slick, the sidewalls are pretty soft, for some cars you might have to take that into account when setting up the suspension. I wouldn't say they overheat, but they don't seem to handle heat that well, they produce their peak grip on the first lap or two and consistently gets slower and slower afterwards. The same with the heat cycling, when new, they are absolutely gobsmackingly quick, but soon afterwards, they are still a fast tire just not as stunningly fast as the first few heat cycles. I've seen a few of the more well off cars compete with these then sell them off after a few events because they werent 'as fast' (Fine by me as it was a damn sight better than buying them new, these things are expensive!!) Wear rate is reasonable, the compound is pretty soft but they didn't wear down as quickly as the D03G but not as long lasting as RE55S or V70A.

Wow, what a comprehensive summary of the semi-slick usual suspects. From my general knowledge, you seem to be spot on with each type of tyre and their respective characteristics on track. The Kuhmo V70A seems like the best rounded tyre for improving as a driver, Andrewtran84 recommends them for their consistency and ability to take abuse.

I personally have only used street rubber (Federal RS-R) on track, and would recommend the RS-R to anyone else. They take one lap to warm up, produce significant grip and can be driven home, all the while being quite cheap. Though I want to buy AD08's next, my budget will limit me to RS-Rs or trying out the Hankook RS3. Has anyone had experience with the RS3s?

I am upgrading my front track by 60mm before i next hit WP, where i want to achieve a 1:10. I believe the RS-Rs in 235mm wide form will have it in em to achieve this time.

[fatboyz39]

We've used plenty of different Semi's over the years. By far the best and most expensive are the Advan A050's.

If you want fast lap times then you cannot go pass A050's Soft.

[PG_DC5]

Toyo Proxes T1-R... worn past the tread indicators.

the bad: absolutely no grip, sliding everywhere
the good: absolutely no grip, sliding everywhere

[M@lew]

235/40 or 225/45 for the rear on street tyres? Going back to a staggered set-up with 245/40 front. I have some 235/40 tyres still good on, but wondering if I should go 225/45 like I will on semi's or if it will make not as much difference on street tyres.

[fatboyz39]

45's abit to tall... what width are the rear rims?

[M@lew]

Front would be 17 x 9 +22 and rear 17 x 8.5 +30

[ChargeR]

I'd go for the 225/45 because it will give you closer to even tyre diameters front and rear. Uneven diameters look funky.