price Vs performance - coilovers discussion

[stevan]

so im in the market for a set of descent streetable coilovers atm and i have come across some "seemingly" nice sets through my research. as we all know now is probably the worst time to modify our cars due to the ridiculous price increases across all japanese branded products due to poor exchange, economy etc.......
this is the cause of those buddyclubs or teins i had wanted costing me $3G fitted for medium range models. unfortunately, i cant seem to part with that kind of money.............so, for those of us in the same position share your knowledge on reliable, well priced coilovers for a more street orientated purpose because im sure im not the ony one in this boat atm.

oh yeh, and the coilovers that have caught my eye atm are the "Racelogic ultra complex", have no idea about them so personal experience/opinion would be greatly appreciated............post up

05 dc5 Type-S vbp

[TypeSexy]

If your after street C/O, i think Tein SS would suit you. I wouldn't bother with new, try to get 2nd hand and installation is not that hard.

05 dc5 Type-S bom

[Didz]

*waits patiently for charger to own everyone*

I am looking into coilovers also. My main concern is quality.

If i am only going to get a street spec suspension set up i would be more inclined to go for a set of struts with springs to match such as Koni Yellow with spings
or the KW V2 ground control kit. Reason for this is the quality of the product is usually better than the entry-level street spec coilovers.

[Mashi]

http://forum.clubitr.com.au/showthre...light=coilover

maybe look here for different options...

[ChargeR]

Didz is somewhat correct a Koni yellow damper matched with the correct spring rate will probably handle better than most entry level coilovers. The problem is that most springs for DC5s are crap. They are too soft and lower the car too much leaving no damper stroke at the front. This is particularly an issue with the Koni yellow dampers because they are OEM length so any lowering eats into available bump travel and makes the damper more likely to be damaged. With this in mind the best way to setup a Koni yellow damper on a DC5 is to get them shortened so bump travel is not compromised, then revalved to handle DC5 chassis suitable rates and then use them with a Ground Control coilover sleeve with perhaps 8kg/mm front and 14kg/mm rear springs.

One particular issue with many lower end coilovers is that the damper has 32million clicks but it either doesn't do anything, does completely the wrong thing, adjusts the bound and rebound damping together, or a myriad of other faults. Ideally before buying a damper it is wise to see a dyno of it to see what it does and what the adjustment range is. I didn't do this and it bothers me . HERE is an interesting commentary on dampers.

Anyway those Racing Logic coilovers you mention are probably crap. For the price how much of the money goes into the inside of the damper? Not much is my bet. Most of it probably goes on making nice brightly anodized spring perches, "pillow ball" upper mounts, and other useless junk. It also seems that they use 8kg/mm front and 9kg/mm rear springs in the DC5 application which is not good, and I bet they ride pretty stiff despite the low spring rate. Hopefully some unfortunate soul has them and can give us a review.

I recommend you read up about what it takes to make a DC5 handle and what makes a good damper. After you have done that you will probably be less inclined to buy a cheap coilover .

[stevan]

................woah! after reading that i think im scared of buying any coilovers for that matter haha. hmm it seems that aftermarket dampers like konis as you mentioned coupled with ground control coilovers are the way to go at this stage. looks like wholesale suspension are the only stockists for koni in NSW so ill give them a visit this week.
do you have roughly any idea of how much this kind of setup will set me back?

[daz]

What ChargeR has said is correct but don't let this discourage you from buying some lower range coilovers. He mentions that most lower end coilovers have heaps of adjustment for the damper and that they affect both bump/rebound together. Sadly this is true for almost all off the shelf pre-built coilovers. I would think that ChargeR's hardcore mugen N1 coilovers which would cost you an arm and leg to buy brand new would have adjustment that affect both bump/rebound together (this could be wrong, there isn't much info on these rare coilovers, but this is just an example to prove a point).
Even the more expensive range coilovers don't offer shockdyno graphs.

I have owned a set of Tein SS for over 2 and a half years now and they have been reliable and given the car added performance. So I don't see how people who haven't used these products can comment on the "quality". It is not very often you see someone complain about the Tein range of coilovers either, unlike buddyclub which seems to have more issues with their lower end coilovers.

From what I can gauge from your posts, it would be safe to say that something along the lines of SS coilvers would suit your needs. They are perfect for street use, can lower your car for looks, and good for the odd track day.

EDIT: Look for some second hand coilovers, might pick up a bargain.

[ChargeR]

What ChargeR has said is correct but don't let this discourage you from buying some lower range coilovers. He mentions that most lower end coilovers have heaps of adjustment for the damper and that they affect both bump/rebound together. Sadly this is true for almost all off the shelf pre-built coilovers. I would think that ChargeR's hardcore mugen N1 coilovers which would cost you an arm and leg to buy brand new would have adjustment that affect both bump/rebound together (this could be wrong, there isn't much info on these rare coilovers, but this is just an example to prove a point).
Even the more expensive range coilovers don't offer shockdyno graphs.

I have owned a set of Tein SS for over 2 and a half years now and they have been reliable and given the car added performance. So I don't see how people who haven't used these products can comment on the "quality". It is not very often you see someone complain about the Tein range of coilovers either, unlike buddyclub which seems to have more issues with their lower end coilovers.

From what I can gauge from your posts, it would be safe to say that something along the lines of SS coilvers would suit your needs. They are perfect for street use, can lower your car for looks, and good for the odd track day.

EDIT: Look for some second hand coilovers, might pick up a bargain.

Now you are just making crap up guy . I have no idea what the adjustment on the Mugen N1s does because I haven't had them dynoed so I am in the same boat as you. Also at no point did I recommend them unlike you who is recommending Tein SS when the simple fact is the dampers themselves did not improve the performance of the car, it would have been the higher spring rates and more favourable alignment. In addition I didn't see you doing any empirical tests to see if they did in actuality improve the performance of the car.

BTW there are heaps of pre-built coilovers that adjust rebound seperately to bound damping .

Anyway any of the lower end coilovers will be sufficient to lower the car. Just pick one that has good warranty and has a good track record for reliability.

[Didz]

Hey daz, i wasnt knocking the lower end coils completely. I was just saying for a street setup, a set of struts and springs to suit could be a better option. It's my opinion, i could be wrong

[daz]

Now you are just making crap up guy . I have no idea what the adjustment on the Mugen N1s does because I haven't had them dynoed so I am in the dme boat as you. Also at no point did I recommend them unlike you who is recommending Tein SS when the simple fact is the dampers themselves did not improve the performance of the car, it would have been the higher spring rates and more favourable alignment. In addition I didn't see you doing any empirical tests to see if they did in actuality improve the performance of the car.

BTW there are heaps of pre-built coilovers that adjust rebound seperately to bound damping .

Anyway any of the lower end coilovers will be sufficient to lower the car. Just pick one that has good warranty and has a good track record for reliability.

I recommended the Tein SS because this is what the thread is about isn't it? Sharing opinions, recommendations, and personal experience. Must admit that the thread starters response after your post threw me off a little, I re-read your post and it did share negatives to both lower range coilovers and shock/spring combo. Also guy I never mentioned that the dampers themselves improved the cars performance. I see what you are getting at though hehe .

hmmm hope we haven't scared off stevan.

[ChargeR]

I recommended the Tein SS because this is what the thread is about isn't it? Sharing opinions, recommendations, and personal experience. Must admit that the thread starters response after your post threw me off a little, I re-read your post and it did share negatives to both lower range coilovers and shock/spring combo. Also guy I never mentioned that the dampers themselves improved the cars performance. I see what you are getting at though hehe .

hmmm hope we haven't scared off stevan.

Yeap that is what this thread is about, hence why I am disagreeing with you. I don't think you have any good reason to recommend the SS I think you are just recommending them because you have them.

[daz]

Yeap that is what this thread is about, hence why I am disagreeing with you. I don't think you have any good reason to recommend the SS I think you are just recommending them because you have them.

Yup, I have them, like them and that is why I am recommending them or at least sharing my opinion about them. I am not saying they are the "best" and he should definitely get them.

[vippy84]

Zeals seems to give good overall points, in terms of ride comfort, camber adjustment..

[mugsee]

If the OP has the money to burn and is after a no compromise solution, I'd completely agree with the suggestions that ChargeR has made as to what compromises are good quality coilover and what to look out for.

However because the OP has mentioned that he's after a street orientated setup to run on (presumably) Sydney roads, I'd take this piece of his advice and ignore the rest. "...just pick one that has good warranty and has a good track record for reliability."

Also at no point did I recommend them unlike you who is recommending Tein SS when the simple fact is the dampers themselves did not improve the performance of the car, it would have been the higher spring rates and more favourable alignment. In addition I didn't see you doing any empirical tests to see if they did in actuality improve the performance of the car.

Dampers alone never improve the performance of the car by themselves. The combination of damper + springs (+ alignment) help improve a car's performance. Its fortunate that when you buy Tein SS coilovers, they also provide springs which should help improve performance

If your after an entry level aftermarket coilover setup, I think Tein SS's provide a comfortable street setup, has a good build quality for the price you pay and is reliable. Their springs are matched to the dampers they provide and although the adjustments aren't ideal to everyone, you get a competent setup that will help improve the cars performance.

[stevan]

im glad that there has been such a well rouded voice or opinions from different perspectives, i appreciate everyones feedback!
at this stage daz and mugsee have somewhat reinstated my confidence in coilovers, although chargeR's remarks are very valid and i 100% agree with purchasing a product with a descent warranty and that can be repaired in this country if something gives.
im interested as to why ChargeR is seemingly against Tein SS's?? is this just because it was named in the "shame list" or some other reason. if so what specific product would you preferrably reccomend.

like i mentioned im just looking for a height adjustable system that gives me a tighter firmer ride without sacrificing too much comfort eg suspension noise, harshness etc, obviously some of these is to be expected.

i consider opionions from someones personal experience to be more valid in terms of specific products, if someone says that they have had tein ss for 2 years and they have done what they had expected then im inclined to beleive them, unless they are just saying so to reassure themselves from an unhappy purchase lol. either way im sure more people would like to have a say on their own purchases and id love to hear them!

at this stage ill probably go looking for best prices on teins and see where that takes me, anyone that knows cheap distributors let me know