Originally posted by wu`
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i run -1.5 degrees camber and my tyre wear is OK, it is just noticable that inside wears more...... retired/ -
hows cornering ability compared to standard setup? and also how about for stand still take off?Comment
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dunno - i have never driven a standard set-up... sorry.... retired/Comment
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I've installed my Skunk2 pro A-arms Front for about 4 weeks now. Upon installation, I also swapped the L-->R R-->L for additional Castor. This was my only change after driving on my setup for about a year.
On a stiff set up (14kF/12kgR) The difference is very noticiable. Infact, I am loving the handling so much more it has brought that giant smile back.
I run -4.5 Camber (so tire wear is not my concern) 0 toe. Normally, additional camber is required to negate the use of stiffer spring step ups, where you get less squat with the double wishbone (squat increases camber as you add weight - minor)
The reason why I went for this set up:
+ Running a stiffer sussy, i noticed that I was losing grip on sharper corners. Example, If my steering wheel was turned between 40-50 degrees either direction, I noticed a small gap where there was a loss of grip.
This was noticable on Powering out of corners, especially in the wet.
+ After a number of track days, I noticed my Front tyres were wearing hard - about a 1cm wide strip on the outside of the tyre right on the sidewall.
This indicated to me that I needed additional camber (i was running -2.5 with a toe out at the time).
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In trying to resolve this front end grip issue, I tried to re-tune my coilovers playing with different settings ...
Example
Lowering the front more than Rear
Lowering the Rear more than front
While the characteristics of the car changed, it never sorted the front end grip issue.
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NOW, with -4.5 camber and +2.5 castor (from the swap) - the difference is light and day.
I am impressed with the improvement in powerout and turn in.
Turn-in should have been improved by the castor change - > before I felt rushed turning the car (or jerky), now you can turn the car in slow and relaxed accurately.
On power out - I can feel my STD LSD pull the car into the apex. I played with higher rear wheel pressure to get a little more rotation and the results were very impressive!! It was like point and shoot for a corner, so I'm going to reset the coilovers for slightly more oversteer.
After this, I will believe that I have improved my handling over stock (I thought I stuffed it up for a while there .. just couldn't get it right). I have much more grip and it sticks alot harder in the wet.
I have been testing on street tyres (205/45/16 Dunlop DZ101) and am very impressed with this change
I am currently reviewing, whether I need additional camber in the rear, but I think -2 is enough for now.
The major disadvantage of my setup is the tram lining. The car tends to dart on uneven surfaces, especially upon hard acceleration, so you've got to stay alert - I am hoping a corner weight and proper alignment will fix most of the tram lining. Also, you get additional bumpsteer from the extra grip in your tyres ... if your shocks are set soft, so this might force you to run stiffer (which might get uncomfortable - I used to have it on setting 2 but now require 3).
I am now keen to see what kind of time I can get on Street tyres at wakefield because I feel that I have as much grip and control as I did with semi's with much better balance...:: Disciple of the DDang Driving School :: ..- Don't rev at me, I get scared -Comment
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very interesting read there...
i'm looking to get the new adrenlines fitted (195/55/15R) and also camber adjusted at -1.5 in the front and -1 in the rear then get the car aligned at heasmens. from your exerpience how would cornering ability increase? also hows your car go from a stand still take off ? i'm also currently running buddyclub n+ coilovers 6F/4R, im not exactly fond off bumping around.
any recommendations for a street car to be more fun?Comment
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yes, Eugene is a track masterOriginally posted by wu` View Post
bigger rear sway bar is easy answer there...any recommendations for a street car to be more fun?... retired/Comment
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The only real way to know whether grip has increased is on a skid pan + Data. A general indicator of increase is the cornering speed. Looking at the speedo midway through a corner is not the most accurate way, but it can give you an indication (it is also dangerousOriginally posted by wu` View Post)
Example - So for me, my camber + Castor change alone has added around 2-4 km/hr increase so my body feels a higher force in the corner @ about 85-90% capacity - ie. not at the limit yet). Exit speed is higher because I can plant it sooner. Biggest improvement is in the wet (I personally believe this to be the better indicator of higher grip levels for my car). However, this may be because I feel more confident with this set up as the driver and not directly related to the cars grip.
My other indicator will be how my tyres wear on the track. If It wears over a wider contact patch, then theoretically, I should feel higher grip levels.
Normally, a pyrometer should be used to determine whether you require more camber. Changing camber itself without data may not warrant any improvements. For your setup - I wouldn't see the need for additional camber.
Other factors of cornering ability - > turn in and exit.
What you can try, which is relatively cheap -> is the additional castor by doing the A-Arm swap. All you are paying for is the labour (unless you do it yourself). Depending on how long you have driven your car for, you may or may not pick up any improvements, but this should improve your turn in. The steering will also feel a little heavier (which I prefer).
From there, it'll be about tuning the set up from a starting point, hopefully improving it as you go. It's all part of the process, learning how to make the changes to reflect what you want. Whether it is an improvement or not is another story, but remember , there's usually more than one way to achieve the same behaviour
One other way, is to sit in other peoples cars to see if you can feel the difference, or if you are lucky enough you may get a drive (but I'm not offering haha).
haha but you're faster daveOriginally posted by tinkerbell View Postyes, Eugene is a track master
... I'm keen to get back on .... missed the last day with the jdmyard folks.
------------------------------------Last edited by euGeR; 08-06-07, 11:40 AM...:: Disciple of the DDang Driving School :: ..- Don't rev at me, I get scared -Comment
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pyrometer is the key!... retired/Comment
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interesting stuff euge..
4deg neg camber ont he front is a fair bit, plus toe out..are you finding the inside of the tyres wearing out signifficantly? is yours daily driven?
i have zeal function xs with vision front and rear camber kits, running 3.5 negative at the front and 2min toe out, reduced toe-out from previous settings to try to prolong tyre life :/
but turn-in not quite as sharp.
agree with the tramlining issues!"What's the point of racing a car that doesn't look cool?" - Nakai-san, RWBComment
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Hey Szy,Originally posted by szymonsta View Post
So far tyre wear hasnt been bad at all but my car is not daily driven as I live across the road from work and I'd usually take the scenic route (with the most corners) to where i'm headed
How do you find the function XS? I'm looking at upgrading my coils to may be function or superfunction ... how many kms have they been installed now? Have they got the same feel?..:: Disciple of the DDang Driving School :: ..- Don't rev at me, I get scared -Comment
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yeah great. really happy with them. had them for a while now, cant remember how long exactly..will check when i get home, but it would have to be 15,000kms id say.."What's the point of racing a car that doesn't look cool?" - Nakai-san, RWBComment
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