The E85 Discussion Thread

[riced_civic]

Quick Question for the People Running E85, where do u get you E85 From???

United, Caltex, or Proper Race E85 Bought From A supplier.

[tinkerbell]

and how's the setup going pizzo?

anymore fuel consumption numbers?

[benson]

Quick Question for the People Running E85, where do u get you E85 From???

United, Caltex, or Proper Race E85 Bought From A supplier.

If its a dedicated track car, get race E85 from a supplier. (Controlled 108octane)

[benson]

look, it'd be even better if i could relate the info to E85... but i can't...

I only know my engine & how it responds on petrol, would love to try it on E85 (I am 12.5:1 CR) but if i did - it would be a caged track car only...

i assume the different fuel density positively effects power, but to what extent is the question? I just keep on 98 'for the convenience'....

If you make the switch to E85, expect a gain between 5-10kw. E85 is becoming more available around Sydney. So i don't see much inconvenience with running E85

[munkaii]

Chiming in from an objective standing point regarding e85 and pump fuel.

If you guys are so worried about the fuel economy and overall cost of e85 and 98/100, how many kms you did a tank or guess figures on how much you have left in the tank is silly.

To properly compare the two:

Fill the car up to the top. Reset the gauge and drive it until the light comes on or near empty. Fill it to the top (let the fuel hose click) and record litres consumed, kms driven and cost/l. Use this to them calculate cost per km, then compare if this is what you want. I think from the numbers I've seen e85 fairs better.



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[fatboyz39]

^ Thats the exact way how to record it, well that's how i do it too with my evo last year when i was monitoring fuel consumption over 10 fill ups.

E85 comes out on top.

[DC245R]

IMO if your making the switch for E85 for costs/economy reasons, i think u have bigger issues to worry about. lol

Yes fuels cheaper, but burns faster, will work out the same in the long run. IMO on a standard setup that is daily driven, the benefits are not worth the hassle involved switching over until it gets rolled out in more servos, at the end of the day, i don't think you'd need the extra 5kw. How ever, built/boosted/track driven setups have much more benefits of switching over to jungle juice. Each to there own i guess.

[Pizzo321]

and how's the setup going pizzo?

anymore fuel consumption numbers?

So sorry,been a bit slack on the numbers

umm i average anywhere from 380-420km a tank..but to be honest ive never filled up more then 42 litres,so the next time i fill up ill be running the tank down until fuel light comes up and then more

Quick Question for the People Running E85, where do u get you E85 From???

United, Caltex, or Proper Race E85 Bought From A supplier.

i get mine from Caltex,they call it E-Flex
i have one about 2 minute drive from my house

[TODA AU]

Just a curiosity point for general discussion
But did you know that most of these fuel's purported to be E85 actually aren’t.
There’s an easy way to check, just use a specific gravity tester. (Hydrometer)

Or cheat’s method which is still pretty accurate
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Quick-Fue...item2c626c0436

Here’s a good link: http://www.jcsautomation.com/temp/Stoich Calculator For E85 Blends.xls

Turns out United E85 is actually E90
Caletx E-Flex (E85) is actually E75
& strangely enough, ELF Race E85 is exactly that (Weird huh…)
Not that any of this is a good or bad thing,
I think it would just be wise, once you’ve selected your fuel brand & the car has been tuned,
To stick with that same fuel brand.

Anyway, food for though…

[riced_civic]

what do u mean that ELF E85 is exactly that???

[ChargeR]

Good info Adrian.

what do u mean that ELF E85 is exactly that???

He means it is exactly 85% ethanol.

[riced_civic]

ah, i was thinking he was gonna reference that to on of the others.

thats good to know that ELF is a proper blend as that what im gonna be using.

[rookie]

Hate to bring this topic back from the dead, but it was an good read.

If someone can give me there L's filled/consumed, Cost, and Distance made on tanks, i'm sure myself and/or someone else could get some numbers to compare the two reg. Cost and economy.

I have a question though, would an engine on E85 produce more power if it were tuned to be richer? (Similar to petrol?)
Likewise, would it be more economic if it were to be tuned to run leaner?

[cordz]

Hate to bring this topic back from the dead, but it was an good read.

If someone can give me there L's filled/consumed, Cost, and Distance made on tanks, i'm sure myself and/or someone else could get some numbers to compare the two reg. Cost and economy.

I have a question though, would an engine on E85 produce more power if it were tuned to be richer? (Similar to petrol?)
Likewise, would it be more economic if it were to be tuned to run leaner?

E85 benefits lie in its higher octane content, which provides a higher knock limit, that in turn allows more advanced timing and added boost for F/I cars,

This is why it's so popular with WRX and EVO guys.

But here is some information from the real experts (American WRX STI guys on NASIOC. Over there E85 is much more pervasive in fuel stations, so they have been hard at using E85 for its benefits for boosted engines for years) :

At high engine load the E85 will want just slightly more advance. The big difference will be fuel/air mixture. The E85 will give improved torque with much richer mixtures than gasoline. Both gasoline and E85 will give best thermal effeciency at about 15% rich of stoich, so the equivalent of 12.78:1 on gasoline would be about 8.5:1 on E85, but E85 will continue to give better torque numbers up to about +40% rich of stoich or 7:1 mixtures, so on a utec you would want to richen up your WOT high load cells and add a tweak of timing to get the most out of E85 from what I've read.

Ethanol and is a very turbo friendly fuel for many reasons.
1. It has a much higher evaporative cooling power than gasoline so the intake air charge in the cylinder is significantly cooler that it is with a comparable mixture of gasoline --- that means higher VE.

2. Its octane as blended in E85 is about 100, its blending octane when added to gasoline is rated at 118, so it is a very cost effective octane booster.

3. Ethanol burns faster than gasoline but has a slightly longer ignition delay during the slow burn phase of combustion so the engine does not do as much negative work fighting rising cylinder pressures due to large ignition advances. The total ignition advance for E85 is almost identical to the ideal advance for gasoline so it does not cause the ECU problems when you mix them.

4. At proper mixture you actually are releasing more energy in the cylinder due to the higher quantity of fuel you can burn. ( Ethanol can burn effeciently at much richer mixtures than gasoline can) That means about a 5% increase in energy release all by itself.

5. Peak combustion pressures are actually lower for ethanol than for gasoline but the cylinder pressures stay higher longer, so you have more (longer) crank angle that is usable by the engine. This lower peak cylinder pressure also helps with detonaton control.

6. It will, at proper mixtures lower EGT's by around 200 deg F, but due to the higher quantity of exhaust gas products it produces you do not lose any spool up (in fact I would wager spool up is better).

7. It is much cheaper ( if you go to a station that is not trying to price gouge).

source: http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=803341

[cordz]

Just a curiosity point for general discussion
But did you know that most of these fuel's purported to be E85 actually aren’t.
There’s an easy way to check, just use a specific gravity tester. (Hydrometer)

Or cheat’s method which is still pretty accurate
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Quick-Fue...item2c626c0436

Here’s a good link: http://www.jcsautomation.com/temp/Stoich Calculator For E85 Blends.xls

Turns out United E85 is actually E90
Caletx E-Flex (E85) is actually E75
& strangely enough, ELF Race E85 is exactly that (Weird huh…)
Not that any of this is a good or bad thing,
I think it would just be wise, once you’ve selected your fuel brand & the car has been tuned,
To stick with that same fuel brand.

Anyway, food for though…

Added note, although E-Flex may have a lower ethanol rating, it has been found to be most beneficial for street driven cars, due to its higher petrol content of 25% start up is much easier.

* the only E85 station i know in sydney is at the Rozelle, United gas station.